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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 25 post(s) |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
757
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Posted - 2014.08.07 04:28:00 -
[1] - Quote
malcovas Henderson wrote:The blame for Ganking falls squarely at the feet of the "victim". Period. Crying about your loss with tears of "I did not consent to PVP" is untrue. That little button called "Undock" is all the consent needed
No ship ever should be Immune to exploding in high Sec. If a group of guys wants to explode an empty Freighter. That is entirely their business. In a PVP orientated sandboxed MMO game, you should be aware that some will help you , some will screw you, and most will never meet you.
Todays gamer is a self entitled entity. Demanding their stuff remain "safe" while they do as little as possible to protect themselves. I detest these types of gamers. They are a toxin to every game they involve themselves in. I'm sorry, I didn't realize the sandbox was all about your style of gameplay. Do go on about how other gamers are self-entitled. |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
757
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Posted - 2014.08.07 04:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Derrick Miles wrote:malcovas Henderson wrote:The blame for Ganking falls squarely at the feet of the "victim". Period. Crying about your loss with tears of "I did not consent to PVP" is untrue. That little button called "Undock" is all the consent needed
No ship ever should be Immune to exploding in high Sec. If a group of guys wants to explode an empty Freighter. That is entirely their business. In a PVP orientated sandboxed MMO game, you should be aware that some will help you , some will screw you, and most will never meet you.
Todays gamer is a self entitled entity. Demanding their stuff remain "safe" while they do as little as possible to protect themselves. I detest these types of gamers. They are a toxin to every game they involve themselves in. I'm sorry, I didn't realize the sandbox was all about your style of gameplay. Do go on about how other gamers are self-entitled. Failing to defend yourself is not a gameplay style. Freighters failing to defend themselves. What? |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
757
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Posted - 2014.08.07 04:54:00 -
[3] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Derrick Miles wrote: Freighters failing to defend themselves. What?
Don't be obtuse. Self defense does not always involve guns. A freighter can't prevent a gank from determined gankers. It's not supposed to, it's a frieghter, it hauls ****. |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
757
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Posted - 2014.08.07 05:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Derrick Miles wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Derrick Miles wrote: Freighters failing to defend themselves. What?
Don't be obtuse. Self defense does not always involve guns. A freighter can't prevent a gank from determined gankers. It's not supposed to, it's a frieghter, it hauls ****. Of course it can prevent a gank. Oh, wait, I get it. You're one of those people who think that prevention only starts when the gankers land on grid, aren't you? While your baseless assumption is entertaining it's also wrong and I'm not really interested in arguing what is essentially semantics, like half of the arguments in this thread. My original comment was addressed at something else entirely and you took that out of context as well. |

Derrick Miles
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757
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Posted - 2014.08.07 05:35:00 -
[5] - Quote
Sibyyl wrote:Derrick Miles wrote:A freighter can't prevent a gank from determined gankers. It's not supposed to, it's a frieghter, it hauls ****. You are absolutely correct. This is also true for any lock that protects valuable property, or policemen who defend neighborhoods. Against a determined criminal, no deterrent is 100%. The question is, why are you looking for a defense that is a 100%? Do you think that EVE owes a freighter pilot a 100% effective defense? I don't particularly care if they have defenses at all, that's something you attributed to me. And I was saying they have preventative measures, not defenses.
It's like you and your friends were at a bar and some of you leave early.
Then later you meet up and one of your friends says, "Hey, after you left someone at the bar came up to me and tried to start a fight!"
"Really!? What did you do?"
"I totally defended myself!"
"No way! How?"
"I turned around and ran away as fast as I could!"
... |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
4467
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Posted - 2014.08.31 02:03:00 -
[6] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Veers Belvar wrote:Certainly with 3 bumpers optimally bumping a freighter it is absolutely 100% impossible for that freighter to warp off. Nope. As long as you have at least 1 point of warp strength, you can warp off. Bumping removes zero points of warp strength. I'm pretty sure you missed the point there. |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
4488
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Posted - 2014.08.31 02:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
I'm not getting the argument here apparently. Bumping is allowed, and it can be done well enough to prevent you from warping. CONCORD is not a police force, because that analogy breaks down rather quickly. But the mechanic is obviously one that's been sanctioned by CCP, so it's a part of the game, like it or not. |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
4488
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Posted - 2014.08.31 03:20:00 -
[8] - Quote
Veers Belvar wrote:Derrick Miles wrote:I'm not getting the argument here apparently. Bumping is allowed, and it can be done well enough to prevent you from warping. CONCORD is not a police force, because that analogy breaks down rather quickly. But the mechanic is obviously one that's been sanctioned by CCP, so it's a part of the game, like it or not. The point is that when bumping is used as a mechanism to make it impossible for ships to warp off between successive gank attempts from the exact same gankers, the failure of CONCORD to respond to such is inconsistent with the both the purpose of OONCORD and the design of highsec. I would argue here that the purpose of CONCORD is not a police force but a specific set of consequences for a specific set of actions. You're right in that they are not an effective police force, for a number of reasons, but I don't think they were intended to be one in the traditional sense.
Tippia wrote:Veers Belvar wrote:The point is that when bumping is used as a mechanism to make it impossible for ships to warp off between successive gank attempts from the exact same gankers I.e. never. Quote:the failure of CONCORD to respond to such is inconsistent with the both the purpose of OONCORD and the design of highsec. No, it's not inconsistent that CONCORD does not respond to an impossible event or that they don't respond to legal activity. I think there's one too many negatives in that statement, but from what I gather you don't think it's possible to bump a freighter so that it can't warp off? And that it's not 'illegal' to bump in the first place? The second part I agree with, but I'm not so sure about the first. |

Derrick Miles
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4488
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Posted - 2014.08.31 03:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
Veers Belvar wrote: To Quote CCP Falcon " CONCORD offer a level of deterrent just the same as any law enforcement agency, but as with any police for they're reactive and punitive rather than proactive." This means that in the view of CCP CONCORD IS a police force.
You've got me there, but I called him out on that as well, and I think the only way you can consider CONCORD a police force is in a role-playing scenario. No police force in the world metes out the same punishment to repeat offenders as it does to first timers. |

Derrick Miles
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4549
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Posted - 2014.08.31 10:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Derrick Miles wrote:Veers Belvar wrote: To Quote CCP Falcon " CONCORD offer a level of deterrent just the same as any law enforcement agency, but as with any police for they're reactive and punitive rather than proactive." This means that in the view of CCP CONCORD IS a police force.
You've got me there, but I called him out on that as well, and I think the only way you can consider CONCORD a police force is in a role-playing scenario. No police force in the world metes out the same punishment to repeat offenders as it does to first timers. Generally speaking people put to death in the real world don't tend to get up and do it again. They're not really putting pilots to death if they wake up in a station a second after their ship blows up. Unless we get into some existentialism here, which I admit might be more interesting than where this thread has been going lately. |
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Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
4553
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Posted - 2014.08.31 11:36:00 -
[11] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Derrick Miles wrote: They're not really putting pilots to death if they wake up in a station a second after their ship blows up. Unless we get into some existentialism here, which I admit might be more interesting than where this thread has been going lately.
Sure they are. You died which is why clone number 175 woke up (unless your the broker, that guy has dozens of himself wandering around at any one time). Yes, but if you can't tell the difference between you and your clone, did you die and your clone woke up, or did your old clone die and you woke up? |

Derrick Miles
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4675
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Posted - 2014.09.01 00:10:00 -
[12] - Quote
Benny Ohu wrote:Veers Belvar wrote:15 minute jail sentence same reason you get an insignificant fine or get chucked in the barracks with everything removed from your inventory but the lockpick you need to ironicquote blow this joint unironicquote and get back to slaying dragons rabbits et cetera the reason is that a computer game and an actual jail have completely different design goals This is a point I think a lot of people are missing in this thread. You can only draw so many real life parallels to criminal activity in the real world and in game since the consequences are far different for each. In Eve causing death and destruction is equivalent to a parking ticket. |

Derrick Miles
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4715
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Posted - 2014.09.01 04:07:00 -
[13] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Anyone else get the feeling that all the people arguing against easily observable reality here is just one super butt hurt guy with a bunch of alts?
Takes more than one to argue. Seems like the 'evil gankers' are just as sensitive as the 'wimpy carebears'. |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
4722
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Posted - 2014.09.01 04:54:00 -
[14] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Derrick Miles wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Anyone else get the feeling that all the people arguing against easily observable reality here is just one super butt hurt guy with a bunch of alts?
Takes more than one to argue. Seems like the 'evil gankers' are just as sensitive as the 'wimpy carebears'. The last time people let stupid ideas get spouted off without challenge, freighters got rigging slots. And the carebears cried about that with such tears as hadn't been seen in years. Don't try to assume moral equivalency here, there is none. I know you saw what CCP Falcon said. After that do you really think CCP is going to budge on this issue? |

Derrick Miles
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4736
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Posted - 2014.09.01 05:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
NoLife NoFriends StillPosting wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Anyone else get the feeling that all the people arguing against easily observable reality here is just one super butt hurt guy with a bunch of alts?
You are confusing "people" with the regular crowd of argumentative forum-'socialites' who no one takes seriously and can't concede a point. Most of the rational people seem to agree that suicide ganking is a problem and does not carry risk or penalties that match the rewards. Its completely broken and its embarrassing that unfair mechanics like this continue to exist in EVE for so long before getting fixed. Does CCP Falcon belong in that forum-'socialite' crowd? |

Derrick Miles
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4750
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Posted - 2014.09.01 05:44:00 -
[16] - Quote
Veers Belvar wrote:Derrick Miles wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:... I know you saw what CCP Falcon said. After that do you really think CCP is going to budge on this issue? I think the CODE gankfest against miners, against freighter pilots, and now against incursion runners is going to force CCP to rethink the game mechanics. CODE is driving hundreds, if not thousands of players right into unsubscription (check out their Venture ganking contest). Every time this has happened before CCP has buffed highec and nerfed ganking (see adding rig slots to freighters, for example). I don't think the numbers are there to back you up. I was against the Venture Killing Contest, but only because it resulting in the targeting of new pilots. I actually counted the number of Ventures killed over that time period to prove a point, and while a disturbing number of new pilots were killed and CCP did nothing, it was a number of ships in the hundreds not thousands. Not every pilot is going to quit after getting ganked, even when you're talking about new pilots, and the ships being talked about in this thread are definitely not being piloted by new players. The risks are known, and while rough, they are something that can be dealt with. |

Derrick Miles
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5080
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Posted - 2014.09.03 11:49:00 -
[17] - Quote
Mama, ooh, Didn't mean to make you cry, If I'm not back again this time tomorrow, Carry on, carry on as if nothing really matters. |

Derrick Miles
EVENumbers
5080
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Posted - 2014.09.03 11:51:00 -
[18] - Quote
Easy come, easy go, will you let me go? Bismillah! No, we will not let you go. (Let him go!) Bismillah! We will not let you go. (Let him go!) Bismillah! We will not let you go. (Let me go!) Will not let you go. (Let me go!) Never, never let you go Never let me go, oh. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Oh, mama mia, mama mia (Mama mia, let me go.) Beelzebub has a devil put aside for me, for me, for me. |
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